Subject: Re: Point to Ponder
Author: JohnD'Arcy
Date: 6/5/96 12:40 PM
Muriel,
The rest of the promises, truths spoken by Him apply to us, of course.
Those are absolute truths spoken by He who is Truth in order to show us the path
of life. The contexts which wouldn't apply to every follower would be those
where the authority and responsibility of their particular office is being
stressed. Even these passages may apply to us secondarily, as those who carry
out the same mission, but don't actually hold the office of authority as they
did. The same would apply to all those who were living at the time, but who
weren't one of the 12 called for the apostolic mission, which laid the
foundation of the Church (as Ephesians 2:20 comments on).
As a side note, the 12 had two offices: bishop and apostle.
This study continues to go deeper, and it is good that we continue to pursue
more discussion on the two most important topics of all: authority and salvation.
JohnD'Arcy

Subject: Re[2]: Point to Ponder
Author: Muriel
Date: 6/6/96 8:36 AM
JohnD'arcy,
I do not think that in those passages Jesus is referring to office or
authority. It seems to me He is referring to how He will teach us
when He is no longer with us physically. Of course, I may be wrong
and will continue to ask the Lord for clarification.
Some more thoughts and questions (you are such a great source of
knowledge regarding the Roman Catholic Church -- thank you):
I also think it quite fascinating that in Acts 17:11, the Bereans
searched the Scriptures (had to be the Old Testament since the New
Testament did not exist then) to see if what PAUL said was true! Why
would we not now place all church leaders under the same scrutiny?
And, when you speak of oral tradition, my question is: what did God
leave out of the Scriptures that we need oral tradition -- Mariology?
Praying to Saints? Infallibility of the Pope? Why would the LORD
leave out of Scripture practices which in the Roman Catholic Church
are so vital? If oral tradition is equal to the written Word, why
bother to write it down at all?
One other question arises in my mind, where does the Catholic Church
get its belief in Apostolic succession?
Thanks!

Muriel,
Matt.16:17-19, 18:16-18, 28:18-20. for authority. And yes,
John 14:26 & 16:13 are authority passages, as many evangelicals would attest.
CRI, for instance, would quote it for their defense of sola scriptura.
Clearly, teaching infallibly is what is being asserted here.
As for apost.succession, Acts 1 shows us how it happened in the early
Church...where Matthias is chosen as Judas' replacement. When the office of
bishop & apostle is left open, they naturally say" his office (bishopric,kjv)
let another man take." Matthias was both apostle and bishop. And al we assert in
regards to apostolic succession is that we have the office of bishop handing
down by oral apostolic tradition the teachings of Christ and the apostles
faithfully throughout the ages.
Another passage which is clearly in regards to authority given to the
apostle Peter, is Matt.16:16-19. Apostolic Succession is implied in 16:19, since
the original text Jesus was citing is Isaiah 22:21-22. In that context, the
office of prime minister was being handed down, given its authority by the
Davidic king. We now have the King of Kings doing the same. The binding and
loosing being promised is clearly in regards to authoritative teaching of the Word to the people.
Where is sola scriptura? I dont see it anywhere. Where's exclusive
authority given to the book, and not to the infallible Church, which is called
by Paul "the pillar and foundation of the truth.(1 Tim. 3:15)." 2 Thess.2:15
reveals two sources of revelation: written & spoken.
JohnD'Arcy

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