Subject: Tgiving (was Re: More Government Sanctioned Theft)
From: email@example.com (E.Holmes)
Date: Wed, 03 Dec 1997 18:05:09 GMT
On Sun, 30 Nov 1997 04:10:46 GMT, in <firstname.lastname@example.org>
E.Smith wrote, in alt.slack:
^Ostensibly, DynaSoar@YGRI.net (Doktor DynaSoar Iridium) said this:
^Thanks alot. I guess it hadn't occurred to you that some of us have
^relatives who were pilgrims and Indians and happen to take this
^holiday pretty seriously.
Umm. I would think if you had relatives who were Indian, you'd
be celebrating Divali. However, among Native Americans, if you
are Hopi you might be celebrating the New Year. Otherwise yes,
it is pretty serious, but not in any warm fuzzy direction that
would bring you joy. Relatives of Pilgrims have their own sins
of the fathers to atone for.
I'm actually of two minds regarding the Thanksgiving holiday &
myth. On one, the idea of a time of giving thanks for all that
we have been blessed with is good. On the other, the mythology
of the grateful Pilgrims bonding with their Native benefactors
is a lie.
The difficulty I'm having is deciding whether the myth is good
or bad. Awareness of the evil that was promulgated by European
settlers is necessary in order for those of good will (you are
one, I am sure) to move this society toward stopping the evils
that continue to this day. I am not speaking of trivial things
such as whether baseball teams use Native symbols, but of real
actions against real people and against sovereign rights. See:
and this 11/27/97: http://www.chahta.com/Warrior/equality.html
Last week, a peaceful march in Plymouth was attacked viciously
by police, ostensibly because they didn't have a permit, which
was something they'd never needed before in the 26-or-so years
they'd been holding the same march, which is done for purposes
of bringing attention to the truth of injustice. Do read link.
And in general:
Listen to Joanne Shenandoah's "Once In a Red Moon" album. And
if you can listen & your heart not break, you have not learned
what it takes to be Truly Human.
HOWEVER and this is a big "however" issue, sometimes the myth,
even when a lie, serves a useful purpose, and I think that may
apply to the Thanksgiving myth. Our children, during the years
when they form attitudes are taught that Native Americans gave
help and friendship to the early settlers, which they did. The
fact that _even in the beginning_ the Pilgrims returned hatred
is glossed over in order to strengthen the myth of cooperation
and truce. Later, as we grow, we learn of the broken treaties,
the prejudice, the arrogance of the New Americans toward those
who only wished to be left to live.
So, the progression goes:
Native American = Good
NA gets screwed
NA gets screwed
NA all get screwed again and again and again and still are, &
don't you think it's time we just STOPPED it?
"We are all related."
^I find that a teensy bit offensive, not to
^mention rude, obnoxious and boring. Maybe this is the kind of thing
^they do in alt.genius.bill-palmer or whoever it is, but that's not the
^way we do things here and I think other people can attest to that
Crossposts can make for interesting conversation. Don't jump
to conclusions too quickly. You've misjudged the DynaSoar. A
misjudgment is not a sin. Only deliberate refusal to see can
be a sin here. See .sig for clue.
^Quote of the Week:
I have my own quote of the week:
"Go ahead. Get trained to laugh at sincerity. When they've
managed to erase respect for it from others, they'll have
erased self-respect too." --- Doktor DynaSoar Iridium